I dream of running an ultra marathon. I love to run single track technical trails, I get so in the zone that I forget I am even running. Unfortunately at this point in time my injuries have all but fettered my ability to even train for an ultra. Right now, I have to keep my total mileage under 30 miles a week and less than 7 miles a run to keep the tendon pain in my foot/ankle from shutting me down from running all together. I have tried everything I could get my hands on to help with the pain: yoga, orthotics, compression socks, new shoes, etc. All have helped to a degree but I am still looking for the magic tool to get me off the ground and running. So I was excited when I started seeing some of my favorite ultra runners trying out a new shoe on the market the Hoka One One. It is an uber cushioned shoe that made adrenaline race through my body when I first saw it and thought that it could be exactly what I needed. It is claimed to have three times the cushion of an ordinary running shoe and yet it is still super light weight. Most people claim if feels like running on a cloud and that it has allowed many people to extended their mileage without impacting their body. They do look a little silly, like clown shoes, but hey if they do the trick I couldn't care less. The only thing that held me back was the thought of dropping $170 on a pair of shoes, especially without being able to try them on first to see if they would actually even work for me.
So when I was out West on a trip I stopped by one of the very few stores in the U.S. that actually carry this new shoe line. I tried on the Mafate (trail) and the Bondi B (road) and was totally amazed at how great it was to run in them at the store. They felt like I was running on marshmallows that would spring me forward and made it feel like I had zero ground impact. They didn't feel like a beefy over-engineered shoe, but actually made my foot feel like I was running barefoot on a marshmallow cloud. I only got to play with them for about ten minutes at the store at this point in time.
I was leaning towards the Bondi B mainly because here in central NJ it really takes a lot of effort to get to a trail to run, so most of my running is a mix of road and trail. The Mafate's cleats were very aggressive and I didn't think they would work so well on the road. The salesman at the store told me Hoka had come out with a new shoe that was a mix between the Mafate and the Bondi B, it was called the Stinson B/Combo XT. He didn't have any in stock but told me to look online and that I might be able to snag a pair.
So I went online and found a pair of the Stinsons in my size and promptly ordered them. I took the salesman's advice and order a half size larger than what I normally wear, since the shoe supposedly runs small.
The shoes arrived and I was very glad I ordered the half size larger, they fit perfectly. They even fit very well with my custom orthotics, which is a rare thing in the running shoe world from my experience. I took them for a short jog and they felt great just like they did in the store, but I did notice that I didn't feel as stable in them when running across uneven ground. I wrote this off as my just not being use to them and that I would give them a long run to see how things went.
The next day I decided to take them on a six plus mile run, I inserted my orthotics and laced them up and away we went. The first mile flew by and I felt great, but still a little unstable. At mile two I started to get some light foot pain that I attributed to new shoes needing to be broken in. However at the three mile mark I was crippled with foot pain. The tendon on the outside of my foot used for stabilizing the foot/ankle was on fire much to my dismay. I stopped and took stock of my situation, realizing that I was already three miles away from home and that I needed to get back. So I decided to experiment and took my orthotics out to see if were the cause of the stability problems I was having in the shoe. This seemed to help a little bit, but I still noticed it felt like I was close to twisting both my ankles any time the ground was not level underfoot. During the long walk/jog home I studied how my feet were landing in the shoes and I noticed that neither foot was landing exactly the same with each step. Instead the shoe seemed to magnify how my ankle/foot would rotate in and out depending on the terrain. I am a neutral runner with high arches and had not experienced anything like this before. I almost started to wonder if I really need stability shoes given how much pronation and supination I was experiencing with each step. Needles to say the thought of returning them really killed the new shoe buzz. I decided, not to be hasty and that I would need to give them a few more chances before writing them off.
The next day I decided to try them again, but as I got out of bed that morning I could barely walk, the tendon pain was still there. I decided to take it easy and gave my feet a couple of days off. By the third day I was feeling good and gave them another shot, needless to say I was back in pain within 200 meters of easy jogging. This cycle of trying them on and doing a quick jog went on for a week or two, before I finally decided that for some reason they were not going to work for me. I got hold of the group who I had purchased them from and they took them back with no questions asked, even with the miles I had put on them. This was a bittersweet moment, since I was torn with the decision of exchanging them for the Bondi B road model. However the store rep didn't seem to think that there was a difference in the shoe other than the tread pattern and that it would probably not help.
So where does that leave me now? I have no idea, all the shoes I have tried on since the Hokas seem ordinary and I am hankering for the feeling of floating on marshmallows. I really want the shoes to work for me, especially since I have not read a review online that is anything less than extraordinary. No one seems to have mentioned any stability problems in the shoe, or given any hint as to why I may have struggled with it. I still have a nagging thought in my brain that I should give the Bondi B's a try to see if they would be better. However, since I don't seem to be able to see any documentation proving it is not the exact same sole/footbed on the shoe I haven't pulled the trigger.
Until then, the search continues.
So when I was out West on a trip I stopped by one of the very few stores in the U.S. that actually carry this new shoe line. I tried on the Mafate (trail) and the Bondi B (road) and was totally amazed at how great it was to run in them at the store. They felt like I was running on marshmallows that would spring me forward and made it feel like I had zero ground impact. They didn't feel like a beefy over-engineered shoe, but actually made my foot feel like I was running barefoot on a marshmallow cloud. I only got to play with them for about ten minutes at the store at this point in time.
I was leaning towards the Bondi B mainly because here in central NJ it really takes a lot of effort to get to a trail to run, so most of my running is a mix of road and trail. The Mafate's cleats were very aggressive and I didn't think they would work so well on the road. The salesman at the store told me Hoka had come out with a new shoe that was a mix between the Mafate and the Bondi B, it was called the Stinson B/Combo XT. He didn't have any in stock but told me to look online and that I might be able to snag a pair.
So I went online and found a pair of the Stinsons in my size and promptly ordered them. I took the salesman's advice and order a half size larger than what I normally wear, since the shoe supposedly runs small.
The shoes arrived and I was very glad I ordered the half size larger, they fit perfectly. They even fit very well with my custom orthotics, which is a rare thing in the running shoe world from my experience. I took them for a short jog and they felt great just like they did in the store, but I did notice that I didn't feel as stable in them when running across uneven ground. I wrote this off as my just not being use to them and that I would give them a long run to see how things went.
The next day I decided to take them on a six plus mile run, I inserted my orthotics and laced them up and away we went. The first mile flew by and I felt great, but still a little unstable. At mile two I started to get some light foot pain that I attributed to new shoes needing to be broken in. However at the three mile mark I was crippled with foot pain. The tendon on the outside of my foot used for stabilizing the foot/ankle was on fire much to my dismay. I stopped and took stock of my situation, realizing that I was already three miles away from home and that I needed to get back. So I decided to experiment and took my orthotics out to see if were the cause of the stability problems I was having in the shoe. This seemed to help a little bit, but I still noticed it felt like I was close to twisting both my ankles any time the ground was not level underfoot. During the long walk/jog home I studied how my feet were landing in the shoes and I noticed that neither foot was landing exactly the same with each step. Instead the shoe seemed to magnify how my ankle/foot would rotate in and out depending on the terrain. I am a neutral runner with high arches and had not experienced anything like this before. I almost started to wonder if I really need stability shoes given how much pronation and supination I was experiencing with each step. Needles to say the thought of returning them really killed the new shoe buzz. I decided, not to be hasty and that I would need to give them a few more chances before writing them off.
The next day I decided to try them again, but as I got out of bed that morning I could barely walk, the tendon pain was still there. I decided to take it easy and gave my feet a couple of days off. By the third day I was feeling good and gave them another shot, needless to say I was back in pain within 200 meters of easy jogging. This cycle of trying them on and doing a quick jog went on for a week or two, before I finally decided that for some reason they were not going to work for me. I got hold of the group who I had purchased them from and they took them back with no questions asked, even with the miles I had put on them. This was a bittersweet moment, since I was torn with the decision of exchanging them for the Bondi B road model. However the store rep didn't seem to think that there was a difference in the shoe other than the tread pattern and that it would probably not help.
So where does that leave me now? I have no idea, all the shoes I have tried on since the Hokas seem ordinary and I am hankering for the feeling of floating on marshmallows. I really want the shoes to work for me, especially since I have not read a review online that is anything less than extraordinary. No one seems to have mentioned any stability problems in the shoe, or given any hint as to why I may have struggled with it. I still have a nagging thought in my brain that I should give the Bondi B's a try to see if they would be better. However, since I don't seem to be able to see any documentation proving it is not the exact same sole/footbed on the shoe I haven't pulled the trigger.
Until then, the search continues.
3 comments:
Just ran across your blog on doing some research on Hokas. I would strongly recommend you try the Bondi as your everyday trainer. I have run in Bondis for about 6 months now and they really are the best shoe I have ever run in. I also tried the Stinson recently and found them to be too soft and lacking in stability... which for someone like you (and like me) with stabilizer tendon/muscle issues is bad. The Bondi is a bit more firm, but still not lacking in that "marshmallow" feel. I have found them perfectly stable, even on technical trail runs, and have not had any issues. I don't wear orthodics, but do use superfeet insoles... again, the fit and feel is perfect.
Here is a bit of info on the Stinson from the distributor for Hoka here in the US, note the bit about EVA foam:
"The Stinson is a response to one of the ways we’ve heard the Mafate being used. There are a number of people that use the Mafate as a recovery/rehab shoe. Typically its being used after hard workouts, or for coming back from a stress related injury. With that in mind, the Stinson has the same midsole as the Mafate, but with a more road friendly outsole (very similar to the Bondi), and a new upper. The EVA used in the midsole is designed to absorb energy, but is not quite as sophisticated as that used in the Bondi/Mafate in terms of rebound. I believe we’ll see people using it for recovery after hard workouts, or for coming back from any sort of injury."
Give the Bondi a shot... you'll be glad you did.
Good luck!
Tim
Thanks Tim, I ordered a pair of Bondi Bs and will give them another shot. So far so good.
Thanks,
BG
All due respect - I do not know your situation, I do not know what injuries you're carrying, I do not know how your running form is, I really know nothing about how you have become so injured and why you are staying that way. But I would have to suggest doing a bit of barefoot running to help get your legs and feet working, something like swimming to actually strengthen your body and extend you beyond activities that aren't currently doing what you need to change your issues, and look to wear the Hoka without an orthotic. They are quite floaty but also seem to support the individual foot where it's needed, and being a 4mm heel-toe drop they put you in a near-natural foot position although you expect to be far from it. The more that you have stuffed in there preventing your foot from working, the less you can expect a result. I absolutely see the value of orthotics - when they work. But if things aren't working, as you say, do the hard thing and make a change. Once you have strengthening work going on and are ready to hazard a shoe - whichever shoe - without orthotics, ease into it. Walk in whatever you're wearing, or even stand around for a while. And as far as yoga goes, there are many styles and many teachers. Unlike a painkiller, it's not going to work right away and the same one isn't going to work for everybody.
Persevere though, dude. It'll be all the sweeter to go for a functional and soothing long run after you find your formula and get through this hard spell. Good luck.
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